simont | Long-distance invitation etiquette

Long-distance invitation etiquette

If someone lives near me, and I decide I'd like to spend some time with them, my usual approach is to invite them over for dinner. It's fairly clear that this is the polite thing to do whereas attempting to invite myself to theirs would be rude, and it's fairly clear that this is because the host is the one who does all the work: extra cooking, making the place respectable beforehand, washing up afterwards etc. So volunteering to make all that effort myself is polite, whereas trying to manoeuvre the other person into doing it is rude.

All of that is well known and uncontroversial. But how, if at all, does the picture change when the person in question lives sufficiently far away that travelling there and back is liable to be at least as much effort and hassle as the duties of the host?

I find I can't quite make a case either way which convinces me. I would feel a bit rude inviting someone to dinner if accepting the invitation necessarily involved them sitting on trains or in traffic jams for longer than I expected to spend cooking, and yet I would also feel just as rude inviting myself to have dinner with them so that they had all the hosting responsibilities. Neither seems to me to be the obviously more polite option.

Currently, my best solution is to issue an either-way invitation. ‘I'd like to have dinner with you, how about it? If so, your city or mine?’ But that doesn't really seem ideal to me either: it's long, unwieldy, and has a nervous, talking-too-much, downright Hugh Grant vibe to it which is rarely if ever what I want. What do other people do?

Perhaps such dinners should always be held in complementary pairs: home and away.

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It's fairly clear that this is the polite thing to do whereas attempting to invite myself to theirs would be rude

To be fair, I don't tend to invite myself to other people's houses for dinner, but on the whole (if carefully picked) they don't mind demands for tea...

I suspect my inclination would be to open with "we should do dinner some time" and see where the conversation went from there, and I suspect I'd also end up more-or-less quits (in terms of travelling etc) with anyone I liked that much (I are fail at socialising), but I have very little experience of this manner of thing...

The really polite option would be to invite them to a restaurant near where they lived, but I don't think many circumstances demand that one go that far.

Surely "would you like to do dinner some time?" would be a graceful path into negotiations about how much hassle the various logistic options might be?

I've dined very well in Leicestershire with a friend from the Manchester area before now, which is a very literal example of meeting him half-way.

You could wait until you both chance to be in the same area as one another for unrelated reasons and seize the opportunity to eat together?

I feel standard etiquette applies fine to long distance: it is always polite to issue an invitation, but not so polite to invite yourself round. The invitation is a bigger thing then, and its true that travelling may take more money/effort than hosting, but I do not see the situation as being different in terms of etiquette: its based on tradition more than resource rationale.

I tend to say something like, 'Fancy meeting up sometime soon? I'm free next week on [lunchtimes] and/or [evenings]. I'm happy to [drive/take the train/whatever], or you're welcome to visit here (I'll cook).'

I'm pretty used to this because I have friends dotted around the bay area, so whilst there are people within walking distance, I often also go to see people in Oakland and Berkeley which is about an hour's drive from here. Before I moved back to Mountain View, basically any socialising required significant commuting, so I feel a little spoiled now. I tend to think that it's better to occasionally risk pushing the boundary a little to arrange to meet up with people I don't know well. As a consequence of this, I've gone from no social life to a not-bad one in a couple of months.

Yeah, that's a sensible sort of suggestion.

I do occasionally end up saying "Do you want coffee/DVDs? I'm free tues, wed, fri night, thu 6-8, sat 12-7, sun 9-11..." and cringe at myself :) Though if you've already established you do want to meet, but are both busy, it does make sense. Not as a first gambit, though :)

I actually don't see it as much of an issue, even for a first approach to someone. I might leave out a list of possible times until they reply in that case, but I would typically still take the same approach. For a first contact, I would probably suggest lunch rather than dinner though, because in some sense it is lighter weight, in that both parties have an easy out, whereas a dinner thing implicitly has the assumption of staying in someone's company for much longer.

I think it depends on the distance. If they live in a different country or at the other end of this one, you could invite them to stay for a few days next time you have a holiday, or if they are a few hours' drive, organise a visit at the weekend to do something like if they were relatives.

And the payback for washing up and travelling is seeing your friends, so really "would you like me to visit sometime" is a perfectly acceptable opening line.

You could try "I'd like to visit your city. If I do, would you like to meet up for dinner?" Unless the city is Basildon or Slough or somewhere similar, when this lacks plausibility :-)

Do you know what relative importance they attach to hassle-of-hosting/time/money/travelling? If you must use an explicit algorithm in the decision-making process you'll probably find you each weight the elements differently.

It's possible that the reason I don't feel comfortable with issuing the invitation either way round is precisely because I don't know what relative importance they attach to hosting and travelling. Hence offering them the choice.

I'm not entirely sure, though.

That's an interesting thought, I'd never really considered it like that, but it makes sense.

Of course, the relative difficulty can *vary*, I might very well say "I'd love to see you, but I'm afraid I don't have time to cook right now. Do you want to come round for takeaway?"

Come to think of it, whenever travelling comes up, it almost seems like the first thing is someone assuming the trip will be one way or the other, the two seem sufficiently different that they come to mind separately. I'm not sure why. For instance, someone might be visiting anyway. Or not think it odd to say "I'm visiting, can I see you?" and expect the other to invite crash-space, dinner, etc if they're free and not if not. Or to say "Please come and visit" and see if any time is arranged.

downright Hugh Grant vibe

I know what you mean. Often overly precise questions can turn out counterproductive, but I never know when in advance, I just see I've written something stupid, and then have to rephrase. Maybe make a suggestion, and let them counter with a different one if they prefer.

The only trap to fall into is if you're both polite, both want to see each other, but have different preferences, and hence in trying to outdo each other in politeness, keep offering solutions that inconvenience both of you :)

"I haven't seen you in ages, how about I come to [your town] and take you out to dinner?"

Harder for you given the limitations in what you can eat though...

Indeed :-/ Several people, here and elsewhere, have suggested restaurants as a means of getting round the issue, but they unfortunately aren't really feasible for me.

offer to take with you a casserole dish containing a Delicious Meal which they can shove in the oven ...

I'm with Lnr on this one. IF you can find a suitable place.

And the whole point is to leave your friend in no doubt that you miss them and want to see them, however you manage to sort it. Yes it will warent a discussion, but that is ok.

If it's someone you know reasonably well, you could go with something like "Would you like to come round for dinner? Or for me to come to $YOURCITY?"

This is probably an area where I am Very Rude, as about 90% of my socialising involves going to other people's houses and eating their food. I tend to solve the problem via the Hugh Grant approach, though, as I always talk too much and sound daft. But generally starting with "it would be nice to see you" is a good feint, and then the other person can make vague "yes, why don't we have dinner at some point" and I can say "Do you want to be dragged to Coventry or should I descend on you again" etc etc.

In general, I prefer honestly laying my cards on the table about what is easy and difficult for me to do, and would prefer the other person to do the same, over trying to be polite. Politeness works by knowing what is most convenient for the other person and making it happen gently without them knowing. The world is getting so confusing with the diversity of lifestyles, eating requirements, people who drive, people who think it is morally wrong or unpleasent to be driven around etc that I don't think I can make the guess of what is most convenient for anyone except maybe closest friends.

Yeah, we have friends in Oxford who also have small kids and so travelling isn't much fun for either of us. OTOH it's always nice to let your kid create havoc in someone else's house for a change, so the cost-benefit calculation is complicated :-)

With them we usually try and alternate. When it feels like it's time to see them, one of us will email the other and say "Hey, we should get together some time, what suits you? Ox or Cam? Think you came over here last time, so if you'd prefer us to travel to you that's fine, but of course you'd be very welcome to come here if you'd prefer." and then we'll just sort of negotiate it from there.

If this isn't someone with whom you already have a long standing friendship and have already negotiated the ins and outs of meeting up, then I'd probably go for giving them the option. It doesn't have to be done in a Hugh Grant manner and it's just way too fraught with potential misunderstandings if your priorities aren't the same as theirs and you could end up horribly offending each other!

In that situation I think I'd phrase it (assuming by email) as something like "Would you like to have dinner sometime? Let me know what dates would suit you. You'd be very welcome to come here or if you'd prefer not to travel then I could easily come over there - you choose!"

Of course, as it dawns on me slowly in retrospect, you could always make a general post to livejournal wondering about the issue, and then both do whatever the other described as most helpful ;)

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Long-distance invitation etiquette

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