I generally agree on your wider point -- intelligence seems to be a continuum we happen to be at the high end of -- but on this specific point:
plenty of evidence for language being used by some primates
I don't believe this, for any meaningful definition of 'language'. Learning that certain gestures result in your keepers bringing you a banana isn't language. Producing a random string of signs which your trainers over-interpret as meaningful isn't language. Bee dances aren't language either. I think there's a real qualitative difference between various things that other species do and the human ability to combine abstract symbols in accordance with grammatical rules to communicate opinions, ask questions and all the rest of it. A lot of the 'animal language' stuff is really just animals using vocal or hand gestures at the tool-use level to get what they want. Other primates aren't just bad at grammar -- they can't do it _at all_.
The evidence discussed for animals using language in that language log posting is most unconvincing, I agree.
I'm not sure how I'd define language, but one thing I think I'd consider can only happen with language is communicating a description of a novel change in the environment.
The primary evidence I was thinking came from an anecdote in a biological anthropology lecture, and relates to vervet monkeys in the wild - unfortunately I couldn't find a reference to it with a quick google search, but the assertion was that vervet monkeys make up new warning calls for new potential predators by combining existing calls. Probably the reason that I couldn't find a reference to this is that it was anecdotal and controversial, of course. Indeed, the only agreement that I can find is that vervets have distinct warning calls for "leopard", "snake" and eagle, and it's hard to see how a combination of these calls could be descriptive, rather than just the monkey being unsure which warning call to use.
Perhaps I'd be on stronger ground if I hadn't included the word "plenty". On searching around a bit more, there seems to be plenty of debate on the subject, and very little consensus.
Interesting points, though, thanks. I wish I had more time to investigate the subject properly...
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I generally agree on your wider point -- intelligence seems to be a continuum we happen to be at the high end of -- but on this specific point:
I don't believe this, for any meaningful definition of 'language'. Learning that certain gestures result in your keepers bringing you a banana isn't language. Producing a random string of signs which your trainers over-interpret as meaningful isn't language. Bee dances aren't language either. I think there's a real qualitative difference between various things that other species do and the human ability to combine abstract symbols in accordance with grammatical rules to communicate opinions, ask questions and all the rest of it. A lot of the 'animal language' stuff is really just animals using vocal or hand gestures at the tool-use level to get what they want. Other primates aren't just bad at grammar -- they can't do it _at all_.
This elderly language log posting expresses a similar view.
I'm not sure how I'd define language, but one thing I think I'd consider can only happen with language is communicating a description of a novel change in the environment.
The primary evidence I was thinking came from an anecdote in a biological anthropology lecture, and relates to vervet monkeys in the wild - unfortunately I couldn't find a reference to it with a quick google search, but the assertion was that vervet monkeys make up new warning calls for new potential predators by combining existing calls. Probably the reason that I couldn't find a reference to this is that it was anecdotal and controversial, of course. Indeed, the only agreement that I can find is that vervets have distinct warning calls for "leopard", "snake" and eagle, and it's hard to see how a combination of these calls could be descriptive, rather than just the monkey being unsure which warning call to use.
Perhaps I'd be on stronger ground if I hadn't included the word "plenty". On searching around a bit more, there seems to be plenty of debate on the subject, and very little consensus.
Interesting points, though, thanks. I wish I had more time to investigate the subject properly...